Today, we’re diving deep into a conversation that’s particularly close to my heart. I’m joined by the brilliant James Graham, an acclaimed playwright who has managed to turn my life story into a powerful stage play called Punch.

James takes us behind the scenes, sharing his emotional and creative journey of adapting my book into a theatrical masterpiece. Together, we explore the transformative power of storytelling and the profound impact it can have on individuals and communities. We also dig into the wider themes of restorative justice, forgiveness, and personal growth, which resonate so deeply not just with me but with everyone involved in this project.

This episode encapsulates so many of the emotions we've tackled this season: the struggles and the breakthroughs, the doubts and the hopes. And I can't wait for you to hear James discuss how this project has spurred his own growth and reflections on societal issues.

Our conversation is layered, rich with insights, and brings forward that unique blend of accountability and redemption that defines Right From Wrong. This episode promises to inspire and challenge you, offering a new perspective on the ripple effects of our actions and the transformative power of empathy.

00:01:09 Looking Back on Season 1. As I wrap up the first season of Right From Wrong, I reflect on the key themes, powerful conversations, and incredible guests who have shaped my journey from punishment to redemption.

00:02:39 Introducing James Graham. I sit down with playwright James Graham, the man who took my story and turned it into the stage play Punch. We talk about his background and what drew him to my journey.

00:03:24 Processing the Impact of the Play. James shares his thoughts on the reception of Punch—the overwhelming audience response, critical acclaim, and what it meant to see the play come to life.

00:04:22 Reaching Beyond the Theatre. We discuss how Punch has resonated beyond the stage, with people in the legal system—judges, politicians, and educators—engaging with its message on restorative justice.

00:07:29 Growing Up Working-Class with Big Dreams. James reflects on his childhood in a mining village and how his family’s support, despite financial struggles, allowed him to pursue his passion for the arts.

00:10:04 Challenging Cultural Expectations. We talk about how pursuing the arts isn’t always encouraged in working-class communities and how James’s school played a crucial role in making theatre feel accessible.

00:11:40 Hard Work and Family Sacrifices. Both James and I share stories about the work ethic instilled in us by our families, particularly the sacrifices our mums made to give us opportunities.

00:14:20 Immersing in Restorative Justice. James opens up about the deep research process he went through to ensure Punch authentically captured restorative justice and the emotional weight of my story.

00:17:11 Relating on a Personal Level. James shares how themes of vulnerability, relationships, and emotional expression in my journey resonated with his own struggles and experiences.

00:21:58 Why Punch Matters to So Many People. We explore how the themes in Punch—accountability, forgiveness, and second chances—have connected with audiences from all walks of life.

00:24:45 The Power of Forgiveness. We unpack how forgiveness is portrayed in the play and the impact it’s had on audiences, as well as on James and me personally.

00:24:55 Healing Through Theatre. I reflect on how theatre has helped me connect with people in ways I never expected and how the collaborative effort of the

Welcome back to another episode of Right From Wrong. Today, I'm incredibly excited to bring you a profound and heart-touching conversation with two truly inspiring guests, Julie Hesmondhalgh and Tony Hirst. Both actors have immersed themselves in the world of Punch, a play that is very close to my heart, portraying an immensely personal story of tragedy, accountability, and redemption.

In this episode, we explore the transformative power of storytelling and live theatre. Julie and Tony share their deep reflections on stepping into the roles of Joan and David, the parents of the man whose life was ended by my single, devastating punch. We delve into how embodying these characters has challenged and changed them, and how the story they help bring to life resonates on levels that are both deeply personal and universally human.

We also discuss the unique ways in which theatre can catalyse real-world change, reaching people not just intellectually but viscerally, as evidenced by the impact of our performances on audiences and even within the legal system. Moreover, we ponder the complexities and emotional landscapes of forgiveness, the immense courage it takes, and how restorative justice can transform lives—not just for those directly involved, but for communities as a whole.

Their insights underscore the remarkable journeys that people go through when faced with unimaginable pain and the paths they take toward healing and understanding. You’ll hear about moments of raw emotion, silent connections, and the ongoing dialogue that follows long after the curtains close.

This episode is a testament to the incredible power of empathy, and it will leave you reflecting on your own capacity for forgiveness and change. I hope it inspires you as much as it has inspired me. So, without further ado, let's dive into this conversation with Julie Hesmondhalgh and Tony Hirst. You won’t want to miss it.

00:03:23 Exploring the Impact of Punch. Julie and Tony share their reflections on being part of the play and how its impact has exceeded their expectations—not just personally, but socially as well.

00:04:45 The Power of True Stories. Tony talks about why real-life stories like mine resonate so deeply, challenging audiences and inspiring change because of their authenticity.

00:07:00 Theatre’s Real-Time Connection. Julie highlights the unique ability of live theatre to create an immediate, profound connection with the audience—something no other medium can replicate.

00:09:31 Preparing to Portray Real People. Julie and Tony explain how they approached their roles, focusing on empathy rather than imitation to ensure their performances truly honoured the people involved.

00:13:27 Carrying the Emotional Weight. Tony describes what it was like to perform highly sensitive scenes in front of the real people affected, and how it reinforced the responsibility of storytelling with integrity.

00:16:48 The Complexity of Forgiveness. Julie delves into how forgiveness is never simple or linear—it’s something people turn to out of necessity, survival, and a desire to heal.

00:18:06 What Forgiveness Means to Me. I share my personal experience with forgiveness—how my understanding of it has evolved, and why it’s often a bittersweet and deeply emotional journey.

00:19:58 Audience Reactions and Reflection. Tony describes the overwhelming responses from audiences—how each person engages with the play differently, but all come away emotionally and intellectually moved.

00:23:37 The Toughest Scenes for Me to Watch. I open up about the moments in the play that hit hardest—scenes that bring back painful memories but also show how far I’ve come in my journey.

00:27:08 Why Theatre Is So...

Welcome back to another heart-to-heart episode of Right From Wrong. In this episode, I sit down with Sandra Barefoot, a pivotal figure in my transformation journey, to dive deep into the profound power of storytelling and the life-changing impact of the Restore Prison Program.

Sandra isn't just a guest; she's been a guiding light, helping me and countless others navigate the turbulent waters of accountability and self-forgiveness. Together, we reflect on my early days outside prison, the guilt that weighed heavily on my shoulders, and how the act of sharing our stories has the potential to heal and transform.

We explore the cultural stigmas surrounding vulnerability, especially in hostile environments like prisons, and discuss how creating safe spaces can lead to remarkable personal growth. Sandra's compassionate approach and her extraordinary ability to hold space for others have not only impacted inmates but have deeply influenced my path as well.

You’ll hear about my experience re-entering prison, this time for the right reasons, and how I grappled with my past while striving to make amends. We touch on the complexities of forgiveness, the ripple effects of our actions, and the invaluable lessons learned from those we might least expect.

Trust me, this episode is packed with insights and emotional revelations that you won't want to miss. Join us in this intimate conversation as we uncover how owning our stories and embracing our vulnerabilities can pave the way for true redemption and societal change.

00:01:44 Meeting Sandra Barefoot. I look back on the first time I met Sandra at a restorative justice conference and how she became such an important part of my journey toward redemption.

00:04:12 The Early Days of Collaboration. Sandra remembers my first experiences observing the Restore Prison programme and the deep emotional connection we formed through our shared mission.

00:05:29 What is the Restore Programme? Sandra explains The Forgiveness Project and the Restore Prison programme, breaking down its purpose, its origins, and the impact it has had on those inside the prison system.

00:08:55 Breaking Down Barriers in Prison. We talk about the initial scepticism from inmates and the powerful impact of creating a space where they could open up emotionally, even in such a tough environment.

00:10:09 My Own Transformative Experience. I share the overwhelming guilt I felt every time I left the prison after a session, knowing I had the freedom to walk away while others remained inside.

00:11:19 The Power of Human Connection. I reflect on the moment I connected with a prison officer and realised how much we all share the same struggles, breaking down my own prejudices.

00:12:01 Facing Full Accountability. I explain how some inmates tried to excuse my actions, but I refused to accept that—I had to take full responsibility for what I had done.

00:13:54 Shifting Perspectives. Sandra recalls how powerful it was when inmates watched a film of me meeting my victim’s parents and how it changed their views on accountability and forgiveness.

00:16:02 The Journey of Self-Forgiveness. We discuss the complex challenge of self-forgiveness—why it’s difficult but necessary, and how embracing our whole story is key to healing and transformation.

00:18:21 Dreams and Lost Opportunities. We reflect on inmates reconnecting with the dreams they had as children and how those lost opportunities were shaped by their environment and society’s expectations.

00:21:25 Storytelling as a Path to Healing. Sandra shares why storytelling is such a powerful tool in helping people understand their lives, reclaim lost parts of themselves, and move...