In this episode, Chad Hughes talks with Sandra Dixon, Supervisor of Western Canada Gas at Enbridge and President of the Canadian Association of Land and Energy Professionals (CALEP). Sandra discusses how she came to her role in CALEP in 2019 and what it entails. The conversation looks at the scarcity of resources in terms of new people entering the land industry, how the roles and titles have changed, and the challenge of providing education and awareness about opportunities in the land profession.

Three areas of education are highlighted: awareness, recruitment, and training. Chad and Sandra address the specifics of all three and how CALEP is involved. Sandra addresses the need to change awareness of the industry by adjusting the perception of the roles as being just oil and gas-centric. She also discusses how much of the work is networking and face-to-face relationships, which are not where the younger generations have their strengths due to their greater online focus.

Chad and Sandra examine how potential recruits can come from people making career transitions, the types of former jobs that are a good base for heading into the land industry, the challenges around maintaining and creating higher education training for land professionals, and what people can expect to see from CALEP in the coming year. Sandra shines an insightful light on challenges and potential in the land industry and the role of CALEP within it.

“So yeah, there's definitely been a decline [in association enrollment] and we want to change that. But we have to make ourselves relevant. We have to have the education component put in play. And I would also suggest that we have to be piloting work programs, those types of aspects where we can get people some experience and exposure to what we're doing. I think that's super important.” - Sandra Dixon

About Sandra Dixon:

Sandra is an accomplished Land Management Professional and the Supervisor of the Lands & Right-of-Way Western Canada Operations Team at Enbridge. In her role, she is crucial in delivering leadership, mentorship, and support for land management activities across Western Canada, with specialized expertise in British Columbia land matters. With a strong background in land management, stakeholder engagement and regulatory affairs, Sandra excels in building and maintaining relationships with stakeholders, landowners, government agencies and regulatory bodies.

At Enbridge, Sandra provides expert counsel, leadership, and support to her team of regional Land Agents, overseeing land management activities in Alberta and British Columbia to ensure operational success. She plays a pivotal role in advancing regional core projects and associated operational programs. Additionally, Sandra manages the annual development of community and stakeholder engagement plans and is instrumental in shaping the strategic direction of her operational areas. Her active involvement in planning and development of teams, as well as task groups, underscores her commitment to Enbridge's objectives.

Sandra has consistently demonstrated a strong commitment to volunteering her time and engaging with industry initiatives. Beyond her role at Enbridge, she actively mentors and supports others, contributing to the ongoing exchange of knowledge and fostering professional development. As President of the Canadian Association of Land and Energy Professionals (CALEP), a non-profit professional association for Land Agents in Canada, Sandra plays a pivotal role in public and government relations. She is dedicated to establishing the highest professional and ethical standards for Land Agents, while also promoting education and training to set clear expectations for those who interact with stakeholders. Sandra’s leadership and contributions make her a distinguished figure in her field.

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Chad Hughes | CEO, Entrepreneurial Leader, Author: website |linkedin

Sandra Dixon |Enbridge / CALEP President: website | linkedin

Chad Hughes welcomes Andrew Fulford, Surface Land Manager of Birchcliff Energy, to the show to talk about Birchcliff’s unique culture and his thirty-plus-year career. Andrew, who got into the industry by going to Olds College in what was then called the Land Agent Program, got offered his role at Birchcliff twelve years ago, and he reflects on changes in his career and the industry while offering advice to newcomers in the surface land business.

Andrew discusses how the always-changing industry offers a lot of opportunity for growth in a career due to the progress and new skill sets required with the shifts. He says it does lead to being a bit of a jack of all trades and includes project management as one of his roles now. One of the things he learned very recently was the role of Indigenous relations when he not only needed to understand the new consultation regulations, but also become immersed in Indigenous history and culture so he could adapt to their way of doing business.

Chad and Andrew talk about company culture and what makes Birchcliff so unique and positive. Andrew highlights the relationships frontline people form with communities and the smooth communication they develop. He reflects on how much things have changed in the industry and how the training now would be substantially different than when he first started. His advice to people looking for a career in the industry is to learn about the whole industry, not just land.

“... when you first get into the surface land business, if you're passionate about it … I say to people, go to where you will learn the most. Go to those. Look for those places where you will gain the most skills and diverse skills. Don't just focus on one. It may not be the best-paying job that you take off the start, but it's probably the one that's where you're going to learn the most, and it's probably going to take you away from home for longer periods of time. I spent a good part of the first part of my career, you know, behind the wheel of a vehicle and sometimes away from home for 1 to 2 weeks at a time… but I'll tell you what. It paid off in spades towards the latter part of my career. And the skills that I built and the understanding that I had about the business when I did that.” - Andrew Fulford

About Andrew Fulford:

Andrew is the Surface Land Manager for Birchcliff Energy, responsible for surface land access, community and stakeholder engagement, indigenous relations and managing a team of 5 surface professionals.

He graduated Olds College in 1986 with a Land Agent diploma and over the next dozen years worked as a consulting landman for several land brokers and a royalty trust company. In the late 90’s he moved “in-house” to the role of Senior Surface Landman for PanCanadian Petroleum, a major exploration and production company which later merged with Alberta Energy Corp. to become into EnCana Corporation. Here he managed a one of the surface land teams focused on Coal Bed Methane development in southern Alberta. In 2012 he moved to his present role at Birchcliff Energy Ltd. an intermediate oil and natural gas company based in Calgary with operations focused on the Montney/Doig resources play in north western Alberta.

With over 35 years in the land industry, he has been involved with a diverse variety of projects across all 4 western provinces including acquisition of linear right of ways for powerlines, natural gas and telecom, wellsites, gathering systems and gas processing facilities, freehold and crown mineral land projects, stakeholder and indigenous relations and crown surface land disposition acquisitions.

He has worked with the Southern Alberta Institute for Technology to help update and develop their Surface Land Management Course which he also taught for a number of years and has also developed and taught short courses for CAPL and CAPLA (now CALEP and LEMAC) over the past 15 years.

Additionally, he has volunteered on various industry committee which presently include the CALEP – Field Acquisition Management Committee and the Olds College, Surface Land Management Program - Industry Advisory Committee.

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Chad Hughes | CEO, Entrepreneurial Leader, Author: website |linkedin

Andrew Fulford |Surface Land Manager, Birchcliff Energy: website | linkedin

Chad Hughes invites James Thurston, a longtime friend and experienced land agent, to the show to discuss insights on their generation and its alignment with the industry. James Thurston reflects on his journey, emphasizing the importance of networking and building relationships during his time in the land agent program. He shares how chance and curiosity led him to the field, working on the Alliance pipeline and later in various locations across Western Canada.

James explores the unique characteristics of his and Chad’s generation, shaped by a lack of parental presence during childhood, fostering resilience, self-sufficiency, and a nomadic mindset. He highlights the generation's ability to adapt to industry changes, particularly during the boom in coal bed methane, and how they navigated through subsequent challenges like the 2008 financial crisis and the fracking revolution. Despite the positive traits, James acknowledges the downsides, such as reluctance to ask for help and potential loneliness.

Chad and James touch on the evolution of the land agent role, from individual well projects to centralized pad locations and a shift to Crown land. James emphasizes the importance of adaptability and problem-solving in the ever-changing industry. Their conversation reveals the unique characteristics of their generation and its impact on their successful navigation through the dynamic landscape of land agency.

“... if I didn't know the answer, I really made a conscious effort to seek it out. And it was a lot harder back then. As you remember, we didn't have the internet like we do now. We didn't have access to information, but I did have a large network of friends from Olds. And, you know, I leaned on that. … we had to all kind of learn from each other, you know, there was a lot of talk. There was a lot of consensus. There was a lot of sitting at a table and working things out and bouncing ideas off each other and really being open to that idea that not every problem has a simple solution.” - James Thurston

About James Thurston:

For nearly 23 years, James has journeyed through Western Canada acquiring land and overseeing large-scale acquisitions.

His path started in Camrose, Alberta, where he joined a small but busy land broker. Over the course of five years, he dedicated himself to acquiring hundreds of upstream projects. It was a time of growth and development, both personally and professionally. But when the call of opportunity beckoned, James found himself in Calgary. There, he took on the role of an in-house landman at Penn West overseeing large-scale drilling programs in West Central Alberta. As the company underwent transitions, James recognized the need for a new path and that journey brought him to Shell in 2014. He’s been able to leverage his skills and knowledge and enjoy a successful career at Shell during an ever-changing time.

James is also a proud husband and father of four young children who keep him on his feet and have helped him grow as a person and as a project manager and landman.

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Chad Hughes | CEO, Entrepreneurial Leader, Author: website |linkedin

James Thurston | Discipline Lead, Surface Land, Shell Canada: website | linkedin