Joe talks to one of our favorite podcasters for another special Sunday bonus episode: Esther Joy Goetz. You probably know her best as one of the Deconstructing Mamas or The Dolly Mama.

Joe and Esther talk about Carl Jung, Richard Rohr, Celtic theology, the shadow self and how non-dual thinking is a key to moving beyond the cruelty of our age.

If you're not already following Esther and would like to, or connect with her work as a spiritual director, or to order her eBook, visit her website HERE.

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