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The Forgotten Creed
- Christianity's Original Struggle against Bigotry, Slavery, and Sexism
- Narrated by: Ramon De Ocampo
- Length: 6 hrs and 49 mins
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Publisher's summary
Long before the followers of Jesus declared him to be the Son of God, Jesus taught his followers that they too were the children of God. This ancient creed, now all but forgotten, is recorded still within the folds of a letter of Paul the Apostle. This ancient creed said nothing about God or Christ or salvation. Its claims were about the whole human race: there is no race, there is no class, there is no gender.
Followers of Jesus proclaimed: "You are all children of God. There is no Jew or Greek, no slave or free, no male and female, for you are all one." Where did this remarkable statement of human solidarity come from, and what, finally, happened to it? How did Christianity become a Gentile religion that despised Jews, condoned slavery as the will of God, and championed patriarchy?
Christian theologians would one day argue about the nature of Christ, the being of God, and the mechanics of salvation. But before this, in the days when Jesus was still fresh in the memory of those who knew him, the argument was a different one: how can human beings overcome the ways by which we divide ourselves one from another? Is solidarity possible beyond race, class, and gender?
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life is one big lie
- By Anonymous User on 12-25-19
By: James S. Valliant, and others
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The Lost Gospel
- Decoding the Ancient Text That Reveals Jesus' Marriage to Mary the Magdalene
- By: Simcha Jacobovici, Barrie Wilson
- Narrated by: Bob Souer
- Length: 12 hrs and 55 mins
- Unabridged
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Waiting to be rediscovered in the British Library is an ancient manuscript of the early Church, copied by an anonymous monk. The manuscript is at least 1,450 years old, possibly dating to the first century, Jesus' lifetime. And now, The Lost Gospel provides the first-ever translation from Syriac into English of this unique document that tells the inside story of Jesus' social, family, and political life. The Lost Gospel takes listeners on an unparalleled historical adventure through a paradigm-shifting manuscript.
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Very well-crafted but uses lot of sketchy material
- By Leifen on 01-09-18
By: Simcha Jacobovici, and others
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Lost Christianities
- The Battles of Scripture and the Faiths We Never Knew
- By: Bart D. Ehrman
- Narrated by: Matthew Kugler
- Length: 13 hrs and 25 mins
- Unabridged
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The early Christian Church was a chaos of contending beliefs. Some groups of Christians claimed that there was not one God but two or twelve or thirty. Some believed that the world had not been created by God but by a lesser, ignorant deity. Certain sects maintained that Jesus was human but not divine, while others said he was divine but not human.
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The Early Church(es)
- By Margaret on 01-06-14
By: Bart D. Ehrman
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David Lynch
- The Man from Another Place (Icons)
- By: Dennis Lim
- Narrated by: Jeff Cummings
- Length: 6 hrs and 45 mins
- Unabridged
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At once a pop culture icon, cult figure, and film industry outsider, master filmmaker David Lynch and his work defy easy definition. Dredged from his subconscious mind, Lynch's work is primed to act on our own subconscious, combining heightened, contradictory emotions into something familiar but inscrutable. No less than his art, Lynch's life also evades simple categorization, encompassing pursuits as a musician, painter, photographer, carpenter, entrepreneur, and vocal proponent of Transcendental Meditation.
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Essential listening for Lunch fans
- By Michael P. Mesaros on 08-14-18
By: Dennis Lim
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Strange Gods
- A Secular History of Conversion
- By: Susan Jacoby
- Narrated by: Elizabeth Wiley
- Length: 19 hrs and 33 mins
- Unabridged
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In this original and riveting exploration, Susan Jacoby argues that conversion - especially in the free American "religious marketplace" - is too often viewed only within the conventional and simplistic narrative of personal reinvention and divine grace. Instead, the author places conversions within a secular social context that has, at various times, included the force of a unified church and state, desire for upward economic mobility, and interreligious marriage.
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Our own fabrications
- By David E. Felker on 01-03-17
By: Susan Jacoby
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Anti-Judaism
- The Western Tradition
- By: David Nirenberg
- Narrated by: Robert Blumenfeld
- Length: 17 hrs and 25 mins
- Unabridged
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This incisive history upends the complacency that confines anti-Judaism to the ideological extremes in the Western tradition. With deep learning and elegance, David Nirenberg shows how foundational anti-Judaism is to the history of the West. Questions of how we are Jewish and, more critically, how and why we are not have been churning within the Western imagination throughout its history. Ancient Egyptians, Greeks, and Romans; Christians and Muslims of every period; even the secularists of modernity have used Judaism in constructing their visions of the world.
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Great Book: Terrible Narrator
- By LB on 12-29-16
By: David Nirenberg
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How God Became God
- What Scholars Are Really Saying About God and the Bible
- By: Richard M. Smoley
- Narrated by: Richard M. Smoley
- Length: 9 hrs and 50 mins
- Unabridged
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This epic, thrilling journey through Bible scholarship and ancient religion shows how much of Scripture is historically false - yet the ancient writings also resound with theologies that crisscrossed the primeval world and that direct us today toward a deep, authentic inner experience of the truly sacred.
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Just Okay.
- By Thom on 10-28-21
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Understanding the Koran
- A Quick Christian Guide to the Muslim Holy Book
- By: Mateen Elass
- Narrated by: Don Reed
- Length: 5 hrs and 55 mins
- Unabridged
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A quick non-technical introduction to the Koran designed to help Christians understand a hidden book revered by 1.3 billion Muslims, covering the background on its writing, a summary of its contents, a perspective on how it’s used and viewed by Muslims, a comparison of differences and similarities to the Bible, and some suggestions on how it should and should not be used in conversations with Muslims.
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Favors Christianity
- By Dianne on 12-18-15
By: Mateen Elass
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Don't Know Much about the Bible
- Everything You Need to Know About the Good Book but Never Learned
- By: Kenneth C. Davis
- Narrated by: Arthur Morey, Lorna Raver
- Length: 16 hrs and 13 mins
- Unabridged
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Bringing to life the world of the Old and New Testaments, the acclaimed creator of the bestselling Don’t Know Much About® series transforms dry, difficult reading into colorful and realistic accounts. Relying on new research and improved translations, Kenneth C. Davis uncovers some amazing questions and contradictions about what the Bible really says: Jericho’s walls may have tumbled down because the city lies on a fault line; Moses never parted the Red Sea; There was a Jesus, but he wasn’t born on Christmas and he probably wasn't an only child....
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decent survey of the topic
- By bookouri on 02-02-14
By: Kenneth C. Davis
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Biblical Literalism: A Gentile Heresy
- A Journey into a New Christianity Through the Doorway of Matthew's Gospel
- By: John Shelby Spong
- Narrated by: Bob Souer
- Length: 10 hrs and 7 mins
- Unabridged
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A man who has consciously and deliberately walked the path of Christ, John Shelby Spong has lived his entire life inside the Christian Church. In this profound and considered work, he offers a radical new way to look at the gospels today as he shows just how deeply Jewish the Christian Gospels are and how much they reflect the Jewish scriptures, history, and patterns of worship.
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understanding the jewish thoughts in the Gospels
- By John on 08-30-18
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A New Kind of Christianity
- Ten Questions That Are Transforming the Faith
- By: Brian D. McLaren
- Narrated by: Sean Pratt
- Length: 11 hrs and 10 mins
- Unabridged
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We are in the midst of a paradigm shift in the church. Not since the Reformation five centuries ago have so many Christians come together to ask whether the church is in sync with their deepest beliefs and commitments. These believers range from evangelicals to mainline Protestants to Catholics, and the person who best represents them is author and pastor Brian McLaren. In this much anticipated book, McLaren examines ten questions facing today's church - questions about how to articulate the faith itself, the nature of its authority, who God is....
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Clear, Careful, Considerate Confrontation
- By Celia on 09-10-12
By: Brian D. McLaren
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When the Church Was Young
- Voices of the Early Fathers
- By: Marcellino D'Ambrosio
- Narrated by: Marcellino D'Ambrosio
- Length: 9 hrs and 8 mins
- Unabridged
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Marcellino D'Ambrosio dusts off what might have been just dry theology to bring you the exciting stories of great heroes such as Ambrose, Augustine, Basil, Athanasius, John Chrysostom, and Jerome. These brilliant, embattled, and sometimes eccentric men defined the biblical canon, hammered out the Creed, and gave us our understanding of sacraments and salvation. It is they who preserved the rich legacy of the early Church for us.
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Masterful summary of the early Church Fathers
- By Mike C on 08-22-14
What listeners say about The Forgotten Creed
Average customer ratingsReviews - Please select the tabs below to change the source of reviews.
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- Jon Anda
- 05-25-19
A credible theory of what Jesus cared about...
The Forgotten Creed and The Lost Way are classics in my (non-scholar) library of early Christianity. Biblical Literalism should have crumbled within a decade or two after Nag Hammadi - but it’s revival by evangelicals is adding fuel to the fires of racism, misogyny, nationalism, and income inequality. Patterson is a wonderful antidote (alongside Borg, Crossan, Ehrman, Eisenbaum, Pagels, and others). His two books together should be read and discussed by all Christians (including lapsed). Progressive Christianity is a possible force to bring screen-weary, polarized, humanity into useful community. If only the Creed had added scientist and non-scientist that community might even tackle actions for a sustainable planet!
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- Kindle Customer
- 05-09-19
Forgotten creed
Good narration. Much history, but leads to awesome conclusions. Very thorough and thought provoking book
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- CLS
- 08-27-21
That’s a winner folx!
Patterson does not let the reader down once again. As he explores this creed and a certain passage from Galatians, he connects dots you didn’t even know existed. Of course, he writes so eloquently, Latin, biblical Greek flow, never tripping the reader. After reading this book, you will no doubt be able to appreciate and explain to others why an ancient baptismal creed is balm for America’s open wounds caused by all the isms separating us.
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- Helen Burros
- 02-21-24
Concealed truth
It’s very revealing to learn that thousands of years ago people were believing a creed that we are struggling to rediscover and learn to live in fully.
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- Adam Shields
- 04-13-19
I considered asking for a refund
Summary: A case for "There is no Jew or Greek, slave or free, male and female; since you are all one in Christ Jesus” being part of an ancient baptismal creed.
I picked up The Forgotten Creed because of conversations around race. As I have listened and participated, the passage in Galatians 3:28, "There is no Jew or Greek, slave or free, male and female; since you are all one in Christ Jesus” (CSB) is frequently brought up. Usually when it is brought up in these conversations, it is being cited by White Christians that are using it to say that Black and other People of Color are in sin because they are paying too much attention to their racial status.That reading is not what I understand Gal 3:28 to mean in context. But when I saw The Forgotten Creed I thought I should read more about the history.
Patterson from the very beginning is taking a clear position. He mentions identity from the very beginning and I think that opening with a clear position of focusing on identity will alienate some readers.But right before the mentioning of identity in the In the introduction Patterson suggests that the common scholarship for Colossians, Ephesians, 1 Timothy, and Titus is that they are a pseudonymous, which he says are ‘forgeries’. That is not a great opening. Essentially it is the only thing that World Magazine says about the book in its short review dismissing the book. Patterson has been part of the Jesus seminar and his demythologizing includes dismissing Paul’s conversion story and removing Paul and Barnabas’ commissioning by the Antioch church and replacing it with Paul leaving in disgrace because the circumcision party at Antioch pushed him out. All of this really undercuts Patterson’s argument with many of the people that he wants to convince of his main point.
The main point of The Forgotten Creed is that Paul is citing an early baptismal creed (one that Paul likely didn’t write but was citing) that called on Christians to transcend, class, ethnicity and gender, three lines that were not crossed in the culture around the early church. This is similar to the way that NT Wright, in his biography of Paul similarly suggests that the early church was unique in the way that it transcended geography (national boundaries), ethnicity or culture, and class. So Patterson is not claiming something unique or original here. But he is suggesting that it was a focus of the early church that seems to have gotten lost fairly early in the church history. First in becoming detached from the Jewish origins. And then becoming patriarchal.
Patterson’s reading is one that squarely looks at power. He says that the separating lines between each of these three groups is about power. He also says that the separation is about fear, I think that is less clearly applied and argued. Because a person believes that they are inherently better than another person does not mean that innately they fear the person or group they believe that they are better than.
Throughout The Forgotten Creed I can gain insight from Patterson and learn about the passage. But for many people that I would want to share the book with, his perspective on biblical scholarship would make any insight moot. If, as Patterson suggests, Paul was not actually sexist or in favor of slavery because Paul wasn’t really the author of 1 Timothy, that doesn’t really help solve the problem for people that are going to take seriously 1 Timothy regardless of whether Paul wrote it.Patterson’s perspectives on pseudonymous writing (writing in the name of someone else) as forgeries is reading modern categories onto the ancient practice. Pseudonymous writing was common, although not usually for personal letters. But regardless of whether you view some of the books traditionally attributed to Paul as pseudonymous or not, they would not have been considered forgeries. That argument is a false one whether it is from the conservative side arguing against the pseudonymous writing or on the liberal side trying to dismiss the content of the theoretically pseudonymous writing. Either way, it is a distraction to the point if his point is to persuade.
One other problem is that Patterson is using ethnicity as expressed in Galatians as completely interchangeable with modern conceptions of Race. Modern conceptions of race started to arise in the 16th-17th century. And is really inexorably tied to the development of racially based slavery and the rise of the Enlightenment and start of colonial powers. So while it isn’t inappropriate to use ethnicity as ancient proxy for the modern concept of race, there are differences and the book would benefit from more insight from scholars of modern racial realities.
A third problem in The Forgotten Creed that is pretty significant to his argument is the late dating of many books as well as the weight he gives to non-canonical books like the Gospel of Thomas. Patterson argues that the books of Acts was likely written to both counter and affirm Marcion. If this is the case, Acts could not have been written any earlier than 150-160. Many scholars date the book of Acts of the Apostles to around 80 or 90. If the earlier dating, which is more commonly held by most scholars is accurate, the whole argument around Marcion co-opting Paul and Acts being written to counter parts of Marcionism but to affirm a type of supersessionism completely falls apart. There are several other places where odd datings also make his argument difficult. But the Acts one is the worst. Even if I agreed with the underpinnings (Paul’s attempt as cross ethnic table fellowship in Antioch was a failure and Acts was in part of repudiation of it), which I don’t, the dating makes the argument unworkable.
On the more positive side, Patterson argues in The Forgotten Creed, that early Christians understood themselves as adopted into the family of God and that part of why they would have affirmed oneness is because they were all of the same status, adopted children of God. What I find odd however, is that there is no development of all people being created into the image of God. The weakness of the adoption into the family of God as a broader theme is that it only applies to Christians. If Christians really were trying to break down ethics, gender and class tensions, but only within Christianity, it is a much different argument than to suggest that Christians want to break down those tensions more broadly because all people are made in the image of God and therefore valuable.
There is also history around the early church outside of the biblical record that is recounted here and is helpful. There is a discussion of Polycarp and some of his writing about slavery and how at least some slaves in his community thought that the church should buy the freedom of slaves from the common church treasury. And also Pliney discussing two female slaves that he tortured to better understand Christianity. In his letter about it, he said that the women were deacons. The important part of this is that a non-Christian says that both women and slaves were within the leadership of the early local church, which does uphold Paul’s statement in Gal 3:28.
In spite of this interesting aside, Patterson suggests that Christianity as a whole was not particularly interested in slavery as an institution until relatively recently. That is not the argument in Debt, which suggests that slavery in the Christian areas of the West started to decline at the end of the Roman Empire and was largely gone by around 1000 and when it was revived again, it was only allow to be revived with people that were so other that they were often not considered fully human. (Which leads to a whole other discussion.) Similarly, Rodney Stark suggests that while slavery did not completely end, it largely ended in the middle ages in a similar way to the way that David Graeber argued in Debt. I do not want to over play Christianity’s early role in minimizing or maybe even ending slavery. But Patterson seems to not even be aware that there was any change in slavery because of Christianity.
The discussion of ‘neither male or female’ does get more interesting because of the discussion of non-canonical gospels like the Gospel of Mary and the Gospel of Thomas. These are later works and he is not using them as biblical source materials, but to understand sociological concepts, the roles of women within the church and how women were conceived of socially from other writings outside of the church. The arguments here are interesting, but again, like many of the previous arguments are not going to be persuasive against preconceived understandings of biblical passages. But there is nuance to suggest that the traditional readings of passages like those about head coverings are actually misreadings because they reference extra-biblical concepts of gender that are culturally specific, and mostly Platonist.
The more convincing part of this argument is the breakdown of Romans 16 and the discussion of patronage and how Paul’s list of greetings, which had a significant number of women in the list matters to how the church was likely organized. This is biblical and this is not teaching, but talking about actual people and their real roles and relationships. This is certainly not unique to this book. Many others have made similar arguments. But using biblical material in a list of several different arguments does give more weight to the non-biblical arguments.
On the whole, I really cannot recommend The Forgotten Creed. NT Wright's biography of Paul does some of what I was looking for from The Forgotten Creed, and so I would recommend that as the best alternative that I have read, but I still would like to find a good book about this passage.
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